On Accents, Star Wars and Other Things

CooliusFreezerCooliusFreezer Posts: 13
edited January 2016 in TV/Movies
Do you live in the U.S.? Have you done any actual research on accents in this country? There isn't much variation here. In the U.K. you can walk down the street and find completely different accents but that doesn't happen in the U.S. If you talk to someone from California or New York (except Brookly) we all sound the same. The most variation we get are from people who weren't actually born in this country. The further south I travel in California the more Mexican accents I hear. Weather they're legal citizens or not isn't relevant to this conversation what is relevant is that they obviously didn't grow up here, but rather in Mexico. A Mexican who was born and raised in the U.S. wouldn't have an accent. Like wise it may be true that not everyone in the south sound like Cowboys but everyone who grew up there do. There are people in the North who have Southern accents because they grew up in the South. It's not where you live now that matters it's where you were raised so all those variations you think are American actually aren't. There's only three that actually develop here.


I was born and raised in the West Coast, and I've gone to school in the East Coast. While at school, I've been told I had an accent, or that I sound like I'm "not from around here". To say that there's not much variations of the U.S. accent is something said by someone who is unaware.
People in California pronounce words differently from people in New York. People from New York pronounce words differently from people in Minnesota. I can't believe I have to argue this. I don't mean this offensively, but,,, seriously? Are you really unaware? Do you really think all Americans, in all 50 states, only share 3 variations of accents? Do you honestly believe that?
Obviously, you don't have to take my word for it. Ask someone who'd know.

Everyone? Are you serious? You think that is Samuel L. Jackson's natural accent? Watch the Avengers and then watch the Star Wars Prequels again. Compare Mace Windu to Nick Fury, they are not the same. Nick Fury is his natural speaking voice. Mace Windu is a fake accent. You could also compare to Snakes on a Plane but I thought it would be better to watch a GOOD movie than to torture you with that. Samuel L. Jackson also does a lot of commercials he basically uses his normal speaking voice in everything EXCEPT Star Wars.


Yes, Samuel L. Jackson used his natural accent, I can't believe I have to say that. I'm beginning to question if you know what an accent is.
I hate to do this, but I feel like I need explain.
An accent is a the way a person pronounces his word. When a Bostonian says "Park the car in Boston yard", he pronounces it "Pack the cah in Baston Yad." When he says, "Burglar," he pronounces it "Burgla," when he says "Smuggler, he pronounces it "Smuggla." That is the stereotypical Boston accent. Which is different from New York accents which is different from Northwestern accents which is different from Californian accents.

That's actually overthinking. Yeah they deserve some credit for creating alien languages. Most sci-fi movies don't even do that and just have everyone speaking English. However just because they put some thought into it doesn't excuse the fact that English should not exist at all. The real life reason for why aliens speak English is that we speak English. It's much easier to understand a story when we can understand what the characters are saying.

It's mostly the human characters who speak English in Star Wars and we kind of just accept it despite the fact it makes no real sense. We kind of just assume they can speak English because they came from Earth but as far as I can tell there's never been any evidence that Earth exists in their universe. Of course there's no real mention of any planet where the Human race originated from in their universe. Every other species has a home world but Humans tend to just be colonists who inhabit multiple different planets with no real home world of their own. Anytime you get into why Earth culture exists in a universe with no Earth you're going to overthink.

You are misinterpreting what I'm saying. I'm not suggesting that our "English" exists in the Star Wars universe. I'm suggesting that, clearly, there is a language that is represented in that universe, that we hear as "English." And I'm suggesting that accents in that language matter. Jarjar Binks had an accent. Maz had an accent. Grievous had an accent. These characters come from different regions, with different cultures. I'm simply arguing that the "thought" could be applied to the RP accent.

I'm not confusing their accents with their speech, that's the same thing. There is no accent without speech.

They are not the same thing. You can't say that they are and then suggest one can't exist without the other. That would make them 2 different things that rely on each other.

They sound proper because they have British accents. Americans don't talk like that. The only English speaking people in the word who actually speak proper English like that are in England. You are hearing what I'm hearing but are attributing the accent to a totally different country than where it's actually from. That is not American, it's British.

I'm sort of exhausted trying to argue against this. I need a second and third opinion. Maybe you'd listen to them.

She looked like she was only 4 or 5 to me. Still it wouldn't matter because even if she had grown up with her father that wouldn't mean she would have the same accent. As I explained before parents actually have little to no effect on how their child will talk. Hence why Sarah can speak perfect English despite her mother having a thick German accent. The only way that Rey would share the same accent is if she grew up on the same planet that Luke did. I know they look very similar but Jako is not Tattooine.

I am living proof that children take accents after their parents. I am a full-blooded Korean. I grew up in a Korean house. To this day, I've retained a slight accent that I can not shake. It's not enough for others to notice (you, for example, may not hear it,) but my fellow Koreans would, very easily. And visa versa. I could even hear it in John Cho's voice. Could you (I am sincerely curious)?

You really need to do some research on accents and child development. Kids can pick up on difference accents a lot easier than adults can. If she were in her teens then maybe she would retain her accent but as young as she was, her vocal cords have barely started to develop.

If children can pick up on different accents so easily, how could you say a parent has little affect on their children's accents? Of course they'd have a big affect. ESPECIALLY when they're younger. That's when they're around their parents the most in there lives.

Even as old as Anakin was in episode 1 he wasn't done developing yet and could easy pick up a different accent and in fact did. For a teenager it only takes a year to develop a different accent. It may very from one person to the next as everyone develops at different rates but that's the average. Adults may take longer. With kids, it doesn't take long at all. The younger the child the easier it is.


You are suggesting, then, that the all of the people Rey was surrounded by spoke in RP? As pronounced as her accent is, that would mean that everyone living on Jakku would have had just as strong an accent. You can argue that Unkar (played by Simon Pegg, who does have an RP accent) could be an influence, but do you think she'd pick up and accent soley from him? That's not how someone develops an accent.

I developed most of my accents in childhood. Yeah I said accents as in more than one. I am an actor after all. All I had to do was hear it once and then I could copy it. The only accent I was never able to do was Scottish because I could never figure out how to roll my R's like they do and at this point in my life I probably never will. I was already starting to go threw puberty by the time I got around to Scottish accents trying to do that with my voice constantly cracking didn't help.


Preaching to the choir, mister. I love figuring out accents, American (which is to say, Bostonian, Midwestern, Brooklyn, Californian, etc.) and otherwise. I, too, have trouble rolling Rs (again, I blame that on the slight Korean accent I've retained), but I could do whatever Scottish accent Craig Ferguson has, as well as Korean, Chinese and Filipino.

At her age in that scene, I don't think she had even developed an accent yet. She was still at an age where little kids are just starting to learn pronunciation. That accent wasn't regional, it was little kiddish.

Anyone who can form sentences will have an accents. We could both just agree that there wasn't a discernible accent in that scene.
by CooliusFreezer

Comments

  • CooliusFreezerCooliusFreezer Posts: 13
    edited January 2016
    That's not really a proper analogy to what I'm talking about. Simba has a very story to Hamlet but they took inspiration for that character from a lot of different sources. Do you know about the Anime "Kimba the White Lion" the producers of that Anime actually tried to sue Disney over the Lion King because of the similarities between the two characters. Originally the story was going to be completely different from what it is now and was almost identical to the Kimba story. The story was only changed after the law suit was filed and that's when it began to resemble elements of Hamlet.


    I'm very well aware of Kimba. And I'm very well aware that the original design for Simba had him as a white lion. And if I recall correctly, Pride Rock resembled a setting from Kimba the White Lion as well, and that the Aunt character resembled Scar. But I wouldn't go as far as to call Simba Kimba. When you read the manga, then you'd know how different they were.
    And you could argue that Ben was inspired by more than one character. His angst and rage is more characteristic of Anakin than it is Jacen. If I can recall correctly (which I might not, I'm no expert of the extended universe,) Jacen was more cool-headed, and not all that enthusiastic about his grandfathers legacy. And the idea of naming him Ben obviously came from Ben Skywalker.

    Who the heck is Giselle?


    From Enchanted. Really, she was an amalgam of other princess, but her Ariel-like personality was the most prevalent trait. But, again, I wouldn't think of saying "She should be called Ariel, or Belle, or Aurora."

    Wrong. This is why I keep using Transformers characters as comparisons for my argument. Just because you call a character Optimus doesn't mean he is G1 Optimus Prime. You can have the same name as another character and be inspired by that character without actually being that character.
    It's not the name that makes them the same character, it's the story behind them that makes them the same character. In order for Ben to actually be the same character not just inspired by Jacen the movie would have to be an exact recreation of his story in the comics. I'm not asking for that, I'm only asking for the name to be changed not the story. He would still only be based on Jacen from the EU he wouldn't be Jacen Solo from the EU. There would basically be two incarnations of Jacen Solo, a Comic Book version and a Live Action version similar to how there are multiple incarnations of Optimus Prime who exist in different universes.


    What you are suggesting is not what the filmmakers intended. They didn't want to make another Jacen. If they did, like you said, they would have just made him Jacen. They wanted a character, and they drew inspiration from Jacen. To call the character "Jacen" just for the sake of making you happy is not a good enough reason to call him Jacen. And really, that's what we seem to be arguing here; what the filmmakers intended, and what you want their intentions to be. More succinctly, what you claim their intentions to be.

    Ben would not be comic book Jacen, he would be Movie Jacen which is technically what he already is anyway they just don't call him that which is very similar to how Armada Sparkplug is actually a different incarnation of Bumblebee. Ben would not be comic book Jacen, he would be Movie Jacen which is technically what he already is anyway they just don't call him that which is very similar to how Armada Sparkplug is actually a different incarnation of Bumblebee.


    I know what your argument is, don't get me wrong. I just don't understand why you think that's an argument.
    Again, it sounds like you want your own intentions to be the filmmakers'. You're saying "He might as well be called Jacen." Just because the characters are similar, and that maybe Ben was inspired by Jacen. Snoke drew Han's son from the light side of the force. Shall we call him Lumiya?

    The reason he wasn't called Bumblebee is because Hasbro didn't have the rights to that name at the time. They regained the rights in 2007 and that's why we have Movie Bumblebee, Animated Bumblebee, and Prime/RID2 Bumblebee but back in 2001 when Armada was released Hasbro didn't have access to that name and had to change it. These are all different characters who were inspired by G1 but are not that character, they were inspired by him, they mostly share his name, but they are not him. Just as changing Ben's name to Jacen would not make him the same character from the comics. He would still be a separate character just one who happens to share the same name, a name which he was obviously meant to have in the first place but for whatever reason was changed to Ben just as Sparkplug was meant to be called Bumblebee.


    I think there are enough differences between Ben and Jacen where Ben can actually be another entity. At this point, you are arguing "Why NOT call him Jacen?" instead of giving actual arguments to why it's necessary. It's NOT necessary. These are different stories, like you said. Can you not live until someone identifies that the filmmakers did, indeed, mean to write in Jacen Solo?

    Here's where I think the problem lies. You seem to be confused as what it actually means to be Bumblebee. Sparkplug is in fact Bumblebee but he is not G1 Bumblebee. I'm not arguing that he is the G1 character only that he is Bumblebee. That's a proven fact if you look at their original Japanese names they are both called Bumble. They're two entirely different characters from two entirely different continuities. Giving them the same name does not make them the same character.

    In case your not aware both Bumblebee and Sparkplug are actually G1 characters. Bumblebee was an Autobot who transforms into a Volkswagen. Sparkplug was a human character believe it or not. Yeah I know that doesn't sound like a human name but that's why they changed it to Ron when they made the live action films. Ron and Sam Witwicky were inspired by Sparkplug and Spike Witwicky respectively. The last name was kept but their first names where changed for obvious reasons. Armada Sparkplug is not human, other than the name he has nothing in common with the G1 character. He is suppose to be called Bumblebee not because he is the G1 character but because he was inspired by the G1 character.

    You are using this analogy as if it applies. I frankly don't think so.
    The nature of the Transformers franchise (shows, films, what have you) is that there are dozens of iterations of the same characters. That is the nature of the Transformers.
    There are tons Transformers and the GI Joes incarnations; there are only two Star Wars.
    Star Wars is in a strange place right now, in that both the Saga and the EU share the canon Episodes 1-6, but stray heavily from each other in the proceeding timeline.
    But The EU is no longer canon. It has no place in the saga. To say that there is enough of a connection between the EU incarnation of Star Wars and the saga incarnation of Star Wars for the Jacen character to be shared is a stretch. The EU doesn't hold much weight anymore, other than giving writers the gift of creating their own Star Wars stories.

    That's different. Daisy has real emotions and may get offended if you call her Rey.

    You don't see the parallel here?
    Ben doesn't exist in life, sure, but I have enough respect for the character to give him his own identity. Surely, you must understand that. You said you were an actor.

    Ben isn't self aware and there for won't care what you call him. Plus if he was a real person he would probably be offended by being called Ben because he is Jacen.

    Hoho, you cheeky son of a nerf-herder!
    by CooliusFreezer
  • RialVestroRialVestro Posts: 6,256 ✭✭✭
    edited January 2016
    I didn't include quotes this time as this is still a really long post. Try to keep your reply short.

    I've worked with several actors from New York and never noticed any of them having an accent. They sound just the same as people here in California. The only thing weird I have noticed is that New Yorkers don't know the difference between Frogs and Crickets.

    Sounding like you're "not from around here" may not have anything to do with your accent but rather your general knowledge of the area. Frogs and crickets are all over the place around here. I was at a bar one night, standing outside smoking and noticed that the entire wall of the building was covered in tree frogs. There's been times when I've seen multiple frogs around the outside of my house and even had a couple manage to get inside. So it seems to weird to me when a person from New York looks at a frog and calls it a cricket. Apparently they don't have frogs in New York so a lot of people from there have never seen one before.

    No, Samual L. Jackson did not use his natural accent. I know what an accent is, I've been doing them for years. Just check out my YouTube channel if you doubt me. www.youtube.com/rialvestro The animated shorts titled "The Rial Vestro Show" are some of my best voice work on my channel and yes every single character is voiced by me... even the female ones... though I am admittedly terrible at sounding like a woman.

    Going back to the Samual L. Jackson thing again if Mace Windu is his real voice then he's doing an accent in every other movie he's ever been in because that is the only time I've ever heard him talk like that. I also highly doubt that's true because people tend to slip back into their real accent when they yell. Mace Windu in episode 3 when he's battling Palpatine is the only time as he raises his voice that he actually sounds like Samual L. Jackson.

    A better example of the yelling thing I mentioned. Forest Gump, every time he has to raise his voice in that movie I stop hearing Forest's southern accent and start hearing Tom Hanks. That's the most noticeable change in accents as Forest sounds nothing like Tom when speaking but when he's yelling there isn't a hint of southern in his voice.

    Samual is a bit harder to pin down because his normal speaking voice is naturally loud. Mace Windu however is usually soft spoken. Aside from that Mace also enunciates more clearly than Samual does normally. He tends to do things like dropping the "G" sound at the end of certain words. Granted they're usually words that Mace would never use but basically anything that ends with an "ing" sound would be pronounced as "in" normally while Mace would actually pronounce it correctly. Another example would be that normally he would pronounce words ending in "er" as an "a" sound while Mace would not. Nick Furry is his normal speaking voice, Mace Windu is an accent.

    Not necessarily. That's only one line of reasoning. There can be more than one reason why "one can't exist without the other."

    Kids can't exist without their parents because if their parents didn't exist they would never have been born. This line of reasoning suggests that we're talking about two different things. This means that one relies on the other.

    Felines can't exist without cats because cats are felines. This line of reasoning implies that we're talking two different words that mean the same thing. This means that saying something I have a cat not a feline is a contradiction. You can't have one without the other because they both refer to the same animal.

    I don't know who John Cho is... Anyway, I have a few questions for you. You said you grew up in a Korean House. Were you home schooled? Were there other Koreans in your neighborhood? I ask because this would effect why you have an accent. If you went to a public school as the only Korean in your school, you wouldn't have an accent.

    Another question I have, you said that you only have a slight accent. I'm guessing that your parents accents are much thinker, am I right? This would actually prove my point that they actually had little effect on you otherwise you would have a thicker accent not just a slight accent.

    My friend Sarah as I've mentioned before is living proof how little parents have an effect on their children's accent. As I've said before, I knew her mother first and when I met her did not even realize they were related. The mother has a German accent while the daughter does not. There's also the other one I know who speaks French, she has seven kids and none of them sound like her. They do have a slight accent when they say certain words but not enough to really notice or recognize as being French unlike their mother who is unmistakably French.

    I've given you not one, but eight examples of children who do not sound like their parents. The only example you've given me is your own personal experience. That doesn't really prove anything. Especially when the information you provided doesn't even suggest that your accent is entirely the same as your parents and provided no information on your life outside their home.

    Kids spend more time in school than they do at home with their parents. This is why they generally don't gain their parents accent but rather gain the accent used by teachers and classmates. Being home schooled will place you in your parents home way more often than most kids there by making your parents accent have a greater effect on you than if you went to a public school. Like wise if you live in an area populated by Koreans other than your parents then the accent is going to have a greater effect on you than if you lived in a predominantly white area.

    The parent has little effect of their child's accent BECAUSE they pick up on different accents so easily. The parent's accent is going to have the biggest effect on the child before they start public school. That's only for about the first 3-4 years of the child's life which seems like a lot but they can't even talk at all for about half of that time. At about 4-5 and older children actually spend more time in school than they do with their own parents. Plus with radio, T.V., and the internet kids are hearing multiple different accents without even leaving their own home. Their parents only account for about 2% of the voices they'll hear in their life time. That is not a huge effect.

    Plus weren't we talking about adult Rey not child Rey? Given that she looked to be about 4-5 she may of had the same accent as Luke. I don't really remember as she only had one line of dialog. Adult Rey definitely does not but she has been without her parents living on Jako for years by this point. Whatever accent she did have would be gone.

    Not all of the people need to have the same accent. Most of them do, but it doesn't have to be all of them. It definitely can't be only Unkar because if he was the only one he would have little to no influence on her accent at all. Plus they don't even have the same accent. She enunciates much more clearly than he does. The first time I saw the movie I didn't even realize he was speaking English because his accent is so thick I couldn't understand a word he said. I figured it out the second time around but I never had any issue understanding her.

    Just because they're both from the U.K. doesn't mean they share the same accent. Also I doubt Simon Pegg actually sounds like that in real life anyway. I don't think I've ever heard anyone who talks like that normally. That didn't sound natural.

    True but I meant she didn't have a regional accent as she was still learning pronunciation. Basically all little kids have the same accent regardless of where they're from. As they learn to pronounce words more properly they'll start developing a more regional accent as "what's proper" varies depending on where you live. This is another reason why accents develop more in school than at home. Parents teach kids to talk, teachers teach them to enunciate.
    by RialVestro
    Ni, peng, nee-wom! Ecky, ecky, ecky, pakang, zoom-ping! Baa weep grahna weep ninny bong!
  • I've worked with several actors from New York and never noticed any of them having an accent. They sound just the same as people here in California. The only thing weird I have noticed is that New Yorkers don't know the difference between Frogs and Crickets.

    With all due respect, I can't really take your experience too seriously. I can't find what you say very credible, when you can only pick up 3 accents.

    When I've been told that I sound like I'm "not from around here", you don't honestly think I didn't talk about it with these people, do you? Because I did. And you know what we talked about?
    Accents.
    I've lived in New York. For school. You said you've worked with actors. I've talked to people. You say they sound the same as Californians. I disagree. I'd go as far as to say I know that you're wrong. In fact, when you say things like that, I can't help but think, "Is this guy PIZZZAA with me? Am I being trolled here?"
    And honestly, I hope to God you are. Otherwise, it would mean you really do have no idea.

    I watched your videos...
    I've taken classes in acting. I've had voice training, and I've worked with a dialect coach. So, I'm tempted to do a video, myself, teaching you how to actually DO accents, and maybe some lessons in support. But I doubt you'd accept.

    You have ignored every link I've provided about accents. Or, if you looked at them, you didn't retain any information. Or, you did, but you don't care, and are choosing to argue against them. In which case, why should I bother to attempt a conversation with you?
    You are say the same wrong things, over and over again, and I have to repeat myself, over and over again. It's getting frustrating. At this point, you are arguing for the sake of argument, no longer trying to find legitimate truth.
    Speech is not the same as accents. Saying so proves you know nothing about either, though you claim to. You've clearly never worked with a dialect coach, or taken a speech class. Such is clear from watching your videos. Don't you dare claim that you have, because you have proved that you haven't in MANY ways.
    Samuel L. Jackson's voice is consistent with Mace Windu's character. He sounds different from his other characters, one could argue any of his characters sound different from the other. But he does not have an accent. Certainly not an "English accent," as you've claimed so many times.
    Find a dialect coach, either online or in life. Go to a voice acting forum. Talk to them. Learn about what an accent actually is. Ask them about Mace Windu.

    Not necessarily. That's only one line of reasoning. There can be more than one reason why "one can't exist without the other."

    Kids can't exist without their parents because if their parents didn't exist they would never have been born.

    This line of reasoning suggests that we're talking about two different things. This means that one relies on the other.

    Felines can't exist without cats because cats are felines. This line of reasoning implies that we're talking two different words that mean the same thing. This means that saying something I have a cat not a feline is a contradiction. You can't have one without the other because they both refer to the same animal.


    Do you really want me to explain how ridiculous this is?
    Do you want me to remind you that you argued the idiotic argument that "Speech is the same as accents; speech can't exist without accents"?
    This faux-philosophical nonsense with felines, and kids; is this really what you want to support your argument with? "Kids can't exist without their parents; Kids are the same as parents?" Or are you trying to create another tangent? "Arguing just for the sake of argument"? Is that really what you wanted out of this discussion?

    I don't know who John Cho is... Anyway, I have a few questions for you. You said you grew up in a Korean House. Were you home schooled? Were there other Koreans in your neighborhood? I ask because this would effect why you have an accent. If you went to a public school as the only Korean in your school, you wouldn't have an accent.


    I went to a public school and I hung out with a bunch of white kids. I stayed away from the Koreans. It's an identity thing, you wouldn't understand.

    I apologize if I sound a bit contentious, but how the hell would you know anything about accents, when everything you've SAID about accents are clearly pulled from nothing but your ass?
    Do you have any idea how accents are developed? What affects them? Because if you asked anyone who knew what they were talking about (i.e., NOT you), they'd tell you a child's first influence is his family. "Little effect of their child's accent"? You claim to have many friends that don't sound like their parents, but you've proven to know SO little about accents that I'm positive you were too inept to pick up your friends accents.
    I have latino friends who sound latino, despite living in the states. I have Jewish friends who sound Jewish, despite living in the states. Hell, I have a friend fwho grew up in Marysville, Washington that sounds like she's from Montana. And NONE of them sound like the other, despite the fact that they've all grown up together in the U.S.

    Before I get to the other thread, I have to ask; is this what I'm going to be dealing with, talking to you?
    Some hard-head who is going to claim credibility that he clearly doesn't have? I wanted to have an actual conversation. A DISCUSSION. I came here, expecting to have a friendly talk with another Star Wars enthusiast. What I found was some guy who is so absolutely afraid to learn that he was wrong that he'll just say the same thing over and over again, as if that'll make his argument stronger, until the person he's arguing at just throws his hands in the air and walks away in frustration.

    I'm at that point, guy. I'm about to walk away, thinking "I've wasted words talking to this man."
  • RialVestroRialVestro Posts: 6,256 ✭✭✭
    "When I've been told that I sound like I'm "not from around here", you don't honestly think I didn't talk about it with these people, do you? Because I did. And you know what we talked about?
    Accents.
    I've lived in New York. For school. You said you've worked with actors. I've talked to people. You say they sound the same as Californians. I disagree. I'd go as far as to say I know that you're wrong. In fact, when you say things like that, I can't help but think, "Is this guy PIZZZAA with me? Am I being trolled here?"
    And honestly, I hope to God you are. Otherwise, it would mean you really do have no idea."

    You did mention that you have a slight Korean accent which may be what they were talking about. And as an actor who does this for a living I would know far better than some random guy who seems to have a very limited personal experience.

    "I watched your videos...
    I've taken classes in acting. I've had voice training, and I've worked with a dialect coach. So, I'm tempted to do a video, myself, teaching you how to actually DO accents, and maybe some lessons in support. But I doubt you'd accept."

    Wait, earlier you claimed that you've never been able to get rid of your Korean accent and now you're claiming to have worked with a dialect coach and had voice training? If that were true then you should have no problem getting rid of that Korean accent. If both these statements are actually true then you should demand a refund from that dialect coach.

    "You have ignored every link I've provided about accents. Or, if you looked at them, you didn't retain any information. Or, you did, but you don't care, and are choosing to argue against them. In which case, why should I bother to attempt a conversation with you?"

    I can't see links posted on this site. I wasn't even aware you posted any. I'm color blind so the link color just registers as normal text to me. I wish they would change the link color to blue like every other web site on the internet so I could actually see them but nope we got this weird color that I can't identify.

    "You've clearly never worked with a dialect coach, or taken a speech class."

    This part is actually correct. I've never needed to because as I said earlier, all I have to do is hear it to copy it. Ever seen the movie Drumline? The main character in that movie can't read music but he can play. I'm basically the vocal equivalent of that character. I've been able to do a Cockney accent for years without even knowing that it was Cockney. One of my co-workers had to tell me that when I was doing it in "Dial M for Murder".

    "Such is clear from watching your videos."

    I'm seriously doubting that you have watched my videos. It may be clear when we're sitting here typing but if you actually heard my voice you'd never know I was self taught unless I told you. No one who has ever actually heard me talk has ever told me to take a speech class.

    "Samuel L. Jackson's voice is consistent with Mace Windu's character. He sounds different from his other characters, one could argue any of his characters sound different from the other. But he does not have an accent. Certainly not an "English accent," as you've claimed so many times.
    Find a dialect coach, either online or in life. Go to a voice acting forum. Talk to them. Learn about what an accent actually is. Ask them about Mace Windu."

    I know what an accent actually is. Despite your insistence that I don't it actually seems to be YOU that doesn't know. Especially since you're sitting here claiming that he sounds different but isn't using an accent. In order to sound different that requires the use of an accent.

    You previously claimed that Samuel L. Jackson as Mace Windu uses his normal speaking voice but are now claiming that he in fact does sound different which means it is an accent. If it were his normal speaking voice there would be no difference at yet there is.

    You've also claimed that accents have nothing to do with speech yet without speech accents don't exist.

    So how can you sit there and claim that I don't know what an accent is when you have not demonstrated once that you actually know what it is we're even talking about? Your statements constantly contradict each other. You say you have a Korean accent that you can't get rid of but then claim to be able to do a variety of different accents, which is it? Both can not be true so either you're a liar or you have no clue what you're talking about.

    "Kids can't exist without their parents; Kids are the same as parents?"

    That is not what I said. Read that post again. I provided two different examples. The first example which you have misrepresented here says that kids can't exist without their parents because if their parents didn't exist they would never have been born not that they are the same thing.

    The second example I used referred to two words, cat and feline. In this example they are the same thing.

    You were claiming that what I said automatically implied that speech and accents were two different things that relied on each other (kid and parent) when actually what I said implies that they are two different words that mean the same thing. (Cat and feline)

    So far here it seems you have most likely lied, insulted me, and now are misrepresenting my side of the conversation. And you're accusing me of trolling you? This was a civil conversation until you started doing this PIZZZAA.

    "I apologize if I sound a bit contentious, but how the hell would you know anything about accents, when everything you've SAID about accents are clearly pulled from nothing but your ass?"

    That's the worst apology I've ever heard in my life. You basically just wrote the equivalent of "no offense but go kill yourself you worthless piece of PIZZZAA." That may not be what you actually wrote but to me you might as well have and the so called apology like saying no offensive, doesn't make it any less offensive.

    "Do you have any idea how accents are developed? What affects them? Because if you asked anyone who knew what they were talking about (i.e., NOT you), they'd tell you a child's first influence is his family."

    Yes, his FIRST influence not his ONLY influence. I have talked to people who know how accents develop obviously you have not. You seem to think that first means only.

    ""Little effect of their child's accent"? You claim to have many friends that don't sound like their parents, but you've proven to know SO little about accents that I'm positive you were too inept to pick up your friends accents."

    How do you think I noticed the parents accent then? If I'm so inept at noticing accents then by your logic I shouldn't have noticed the parents had accents either. Why would I notice the parents and not the kids unless the kids didn't have one to notice? Wanna explain that one smart guy?

    "I have latino friends who sound latino, despite living in the states. I have Jewish friends who sound Jewish, despite living in the states. Hell, I have a friend fwho grew up in Marysville, Washington that sounds like she's from Montana. And NONE of them sound like the other, despite the fact that they've all grown up together in the U.S."

    Yeah I've come to the conclusion that you're actually just making this up to troll me. What the hell are you even doing on this site because you're clearly not a nerdfighter.

    "I wanted to have an actual conversation. A DISCUSSION."

    That's what we were having. You fired the first shot and turned this discussion into an attack against me. This entire post has just been you spitting in my face and making me feel like PIZZZAA. I come here to have actual discussions not to be insulted by some faceless bully who doesn't belong here in the first place.

    "I came here, expecting to have a friendly talk with another Star Wars enthusiast."

    If you had kept this conversation civil we'd have been able to do that. Seriously, when was I ever rude to you? You're the one coming in here taking my entire life apart and telling me it's not worth a damn. Not literally of course but this is my entire life. I've been doing this since I was a kid, I've worked in theater professionally, and you treat my experience like it doesn't exist. Do you realize how insulting that is for me? You might as well be telling me to kill myself because obviously to you my life never amounted to anything. That's how insulted I am by you right now.

    If you really want to have a friendly talk then be more careful how you say things. This post was extremely disrespectful and I have enough problems without having to deal with this kind of bullying.
    Ni, peng, nee-wom! Ecky, ecky, ecky, pakang, zoom-ping! Baa weep grahna weep ninny bong!
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